Re: [acb-l] Out of bounds is the call

All,
Responding to John's question, I am not against voter ID laws. What I
am, is For the right of all Citizens to vote.
Back in 1969, when I first joined the old Washington State Association
of the Blind, I expected that I had the right to speak my mind and to
vote for what, or whom I supported.
I also believed that as a member, I had certain responsibilities to
the Organization. Since that day I have held membership in local,
state and national organizations of the blind. During those 48 years,
I have always held one position or another, serving today as Secretary
of the Jefferson County Council of the Blind.
In my mind, membership in an organization calls for each member to
serve the organization, and to expect that the organization serves
them in return.
If this is true of the organizations we join, it goes double for our
"membership" in our nation.
My agreement with the United States of America is that as long as I am
a citizen, I will uphold my responsibilities, and I will expect my
government to protect me and defend my rights.
When my government denies any citizen, for any reason, the right to
vote, or makes that right nearly impossible, I consider it to be a
breech in my governments commitment to All of its citizens.
When I joined the Washington State Employees Union, I paid my dues and
had the right to attend meetings, speak my mind, and vote. When I
became director of the Training Center, the Union told me that as a
member of management I was no longer eligible to vote. I could still
pay dues and attend meetings, but no vote. I told the Union that
while I continued to support the right of public employees to
organize, I would not pay dues when I was denied the vote.
I feel the same way toward the USA. And I feel the same way toward
the ACB. True, we are organized around our convention, but our
convention is directed by the grass root nature of the ACB.
Each year I pay my dues, attend all chapter meetings, attend the state
convention, vote and speak my mind. I feel that I am a full,
participating member of this ACB organization.
Each of us needs to think seriously as to how we go about protecting
our grass roots, member driven organization, to ensure that the ACB is
always an open organization, standing with all members. And this
should be our desire for our American government, too. Our
citizenship must always be our ticket to all of the rights, privileges
and responsibilities of our nation.

Carl Jarvis



On 12/28/16, John Heim via acb-l <acb-l@acblists.org> wrote:
> Does all that mean you're against voter ID laws?
>
> I think we should start by agreeing to one simple fact: There is no
> evidence that voter fraud is a significant problem in this country.
> Quite the contrary, study after study has has shown that it is not a
> problem. All attempts to show that voter fraud is a significant problem
> have failed. Is that one fact or three? Well, one simple fact, voter
> fraud is not a problem.
>
>
>
>
> On 12/28/2016 10:53 AM, Carl Jarvis wrote:
>> Voter ID laws affect blind and sighted alike. As subscribers to the
>> ACB list, we should be able to sort out the issues and come to some
>> sort of agreement on what we can demand of our state and federal
>> governments.
>> For openers, I see two major positions at odds with one another. Both
>> positions go back to the formation of our government. In
>> establishing the Oligarchy that we call The United States of America,
>> the Founding Fathers debated long and hard over just who should have
>> the right to vote. There was, and continues to be a fear of the
>> Masses. Some Founding Fathers felt that allowing the rank and file
>> citizens a vote, would create a threat to their view of democracy.
>> The final determination was that people who were over 21 years of age,
>> a landowner or possessor of a high level of wealth, male and White,
>> would be so invested in the new government as to work to protect it.
>> The belief that all citizens had a right to a say in their government
>> was the loser. Over the years some modification has occurred. We
>> added Women and changed the age to 18, and gave the right to vote to
>> all citizens. But the forces around the protection of the Oligarchy
>> quickly recognized the threat to their preferred position, and began
>> to find ways of limiting the vote. During the early years following
>> the Civil War, and continuing up to our current times, intimidation
>> was used to keep Blacks, non Whites and certain "undesirable" Whites
>> from casting ballots.
>> As long as we allow our right to vote to be restricted, we have no
>> claim to the line in our pledge of allegiance, which says One Nation,
>> Indivisible, With Liberty and Justice For All.
>> We blind men and women are among the most vulnerable of Americans. We
>> depend upon public services such as our Rehab Programs, and our SSI,
>> to underwrite our struggle toward independence. My own position is
>> that we should raise a single voice in support of the right of all
>> citizens to vote. Personally, I would include those persons
>> incarcerated. Serving time should not exclude a persons right to
>> vote.
>>
>> Carl Jarvis
>>
>>
>> On 12/28/16, John Heim via acb-l <acb-l@acblists.org> wrote:
>>> Carl, you say, "We can discuss how we can organize ourselves to
>>> meet and deal with those most pressing issues." Can we?
>>>
>>> I don't think so. I don't think we can even discuss something as clearly
>>> important to our cause as voter ID laws on this list much less something
>>> more tangential like pollution. I don't mean the moderator would tell
>>> us we're off topic. Pollution might be off topic but I believe Bob has
>>> already said that he thinks voter ID laws are on topic. What I mean is
>>> that people on this list aren't willing to actually discuss voter ID
>>> laws or anything else for that matter.
>>>
>>> On 12/28/2016 09:39 AM, Carl Jarvis via acb-l wrote:
>>>> First, this is Carl Jarvis. No one has done anything with me...that I
>>>> know of. Work, that old four letter curse, has kept us busy. Seems
>>>> like the older our population becomes, the more of us develop things
>>>> like Macular Degeneration. And the vision issues are complicated by
>>>> age related issues, like hearing loss, lack of strength, short term
>>>> memory issues, and crankiness.
>>>> So we've had our hands full, and not been able to do much on-list.
>>>> I think, in response to my old friend Kevin's remarks, we certainly
>>>> can bring most of our concerns around to focusing on blindness related
>>>> subjects. That is because we blind folk actually live on the same
>>>> planet, breathe the same polluted air, drink the same contaminated
>>>> water, and jockey for the same space as our sighted brothers and
>>>> sisters. What affects Americans in general, affects the Blind, too.
>>>> We don't need to rant on this list, that can be done on lists such as
>>>> Blind Democracy, but we can discuss how we can organize ourselves to
>>>> meet and deal with those most pressing issues. And if that is not the
>>>> purpose of the ACB list, then we can all move over to the ACB chat
>>>> list...assuming it's still up and running.
>>>> But my point is, we can all work together in defining problems and
>>>> developing possible solutions, without the need to agree on our
>>>> personal beliefs. We should be able to prove that as adults, we can
>>>> stay on the issue without resorting to name calling, or...as I
>>>> sometimes am prone to do, going off on a wild rant.
>>>>
>>>> Finally, a most happy and productive New Year wish from The Jarvis' to
>>>> all of you.
>>>>
>>>> Carl Jarvis
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 12/27/16, Kevin Frankeberger <k_frankeberger@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>> I think that is what Bob said.
>>>>> I'd love to respond to friend, fellow WA state resident Carl along
>>>>> with
>>>>> Alice, Ann P. and you too, Richard along with John and others. But
>>>>> such
>>>>> discussion has been called, "out of bounds" by our list moderator Bob.
>>>>> I do need to be careful as I am an appointed judge in our little
>>>>> county
>>>>> for
>>>>> our Board of Equalization. That said, our three County Commissioners
>>>>> certainly know of my more "left of center" political leanings. Still,
>>>>> I
>>>>> try
>>>>> to do my job without my own set of ethos impacted upon those who
>>>>> appear
>>>>> before us.
>>>>> Maybe with that thought we can move our discussions back to how we can
>>>>> move
>>>>> the needs of us blind to the forefront knowing the new political
>>>>> climate
>>>>> we
>>>>> are facing or, will face. That, with putting our own values or ethos
>>>>> in
>>>>> check until we know what we truly will face.
>>>>> I suspect we will have a lot of advocacy in front of us. As your
>>>>> resources
>>>>> might allow, a financial gift to ACB is needed now more then ever so
>>>>> we
>>>>> can
>>>>> pay to be heard...sad as that is.
>>>>> Best,Kevin with Tomasso
>>>>>
>>>>> From: Richard Driscoll via acb-l <acb-l@acblists.org>
>>>>> To: Alice Dampman Humel <alicedh@verizon.net>; Carl Jarvis
>>>>> <carjar82@gmail.com>
>>>>> Cc: acb-l@acblists.org
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2016 4:01 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [acb-l] [leadership] Article: Blind man sets out alone
>>>>> in
>>>>> Google's driverless car
>>>>>
>>>>> Alice: All I did was make a suggestion.
>>>>> Richard
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/27/2016 10:31 AM, Alice Dampman Humel wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> response to the last two posts from Carl, or whoever you are: who
>>>>> are
>>>>> you,
>>>>> and what have you done with Carl?
>>>>> On Dec 20, 2016, at 9:28 PM, Carl Jarvis via acb-l
>>>>> <acb-l@acblists.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Donald Trump, crazy like a Fox.
>>>>> We miss assessed Trump from the get go.
>>>>> It troubles me that so many folks are spending so much energy on wild
>>>>> speculation regarding what the Trumpster has in store for us, instead
>>>>> of assessing how we blind people can make some progress within this
>>>>> new regime.
>>>>> We need to dust off our wish list and determine which issues are most
>>>>> urgent, and then gather and plan how to sell this heavily weighted
>>>>> Republican Congress to support us.
>>>>>
>>>>> Carl Jarvis
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/20/16, Richard Driscoll via acb-l <acb-l@acblists.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Ann P:
>>>>>
>>>>> Your diagnosis of Mr. Trump's behavior is quite correct. However, in
>>>>> your consideration of same, please entertain the thought that he may
>>>>> be
>>>>> acting in a deliberate and well planned course of action to spread
>>>>> confusion amongst his political adversaries.
>>>>>
>>>>> Richard
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/20/2016 5:08 AM, akp--- via acb-l wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> After the incident at the Pizza parlor, I'm skeptical of anything in
>>>>> the
>>>>> media. Having the Russians tamper with our election process suits
>>>>> somebody's agenda. Therefore, it's been printed and transmitted over
>>>>> the
>>>>> net. Is it true, Hell if I know. All I do know is that the
>>>>> electoral
>>>>> College has chosen to elect a loose-mouthed self-absorbed, idiot!
>>>>> All
>>>>> I
>>>>> can do is try my best to protect myself and my friends from whatever
>>>>> is
>>>>> coming. I don't know what that is. The media is fractured on this
>>>>> point.
>>>>> So, I'm taking Mad-Eye Moody's prescription. "Constant vigilance".
>>>>> I
>>>>> am
>>>>> prepared to trust only what I can perceive with my senses. I will
>>>>> leave
>>>>> the Internet and media pundits to wrangle and shout. I'm not paying
>>>>> any
>>>>> attention.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ann P.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Carl Jarvis via acb-l [mailto:acb-l@acblists.org]
>>>>> Sent: Monday, December 19, 2016 8:31 PM
>>>>> To: John Heim <john@johnheim.com>
>>>>> Cc: acb-l@acblists.org
>>>>> Subject: Re: [acb-l] [leadership] Article: Blind man sets out alone
>>>>> in
>>>>> Google's driverless car
>>>>>
>>>>> Well now, that's two separate issues. I may have lost my mind, but
>>>>> my
>>>>> point that I was cleverly trying to make...with such high level of
>>>>> wit
>>>>> and
>>>>> humor, was that I don't buy the Russians tampering with our election
>>>>> garbage. Maybe after we clean up our own bungling of our own
>>>>> election
>>>>> process, maybe then I'll be up to thinking about the return of the
>>>>> Evil
>>>>> Empire.
>>>>>
>>>>> Carl Jarvis
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/19/16, John Heim <john@johnheim.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Dude... Santa is make-believe. Putin is not.
>>>>>
>>>>> I mean seriously, WTF? The Russians might have hacked into our voting
>>>>> machines and made Donald Trump President. You're comparing that to
>>>>> Santa making a list and checking it twice? Have you lost your mind?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/19/2016 07:06 PM, Carl Jarvis wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> From the beginning of the Human Species, we've had someone meddling
>>>>> in our personal affairs. I mean, look at old Adam. One bite of the
>>>>> fruit from the tree of knowledge, and someone told God on him. And
>>>>> who squealed on Nero when Rome was burning and Nero was just fiddling
>>>>> around?
>>>>> Of course it can be to our benefit when someone spills the beans.
>>>>> Remember Paul Revere? "The British are coming! The British are
>>>>> coming!" Thank goodness for that!
>>>>> Sure, it was so much simpler back before the internet. Even wen the
>>>>> FBI tapped telephones back during the "Red Scare" of the late 40's,
>>>>> you could hear a loud "click" on your phone...not that our phone was
>>>>> ever tapped. But on the internet? Someone could very well be
>>>>> snooping around right now and we'd never know it.
>>>>> Of course that's supposed to keeps us all on our best behavior. I
>>>>> remember my mother telling me that Santa watched me all year long, to
>>>>> see if I'd been good or bad. I told a little friend of mine that
>>>>> Santa watched us every day. She said, "That's not true. Jesus
>>>>> watches us." Same difference, I guess.
>>>>> Anyway, I do not worry about the Russians meddling in our political
>>>>> affairs. For one reason, they have enough troubles of their own.
>>>>> For another, we are about as busy meddling in their affairs as they
>>>>> are in ours. And finally, I worry more about some of our home grown
>>>>> meddlers more than infiltrators. And lastly, would we behave any
>>>>> different on this list if we learned that someone was spying on us?
>>>>> If we're being honest in what we write, who cares how many Special
>>>>> Agents are lurking? At some point I decided to say what I meant, and
>>>>> do my best whether Santa was watching, or not.
>>>>>
>>>>> Carl Jarvis
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/19/16, John Heim <john@johnheim.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm glad to see this stuff is registering with people. This stuff
>>>>> about the Russians interfering in our election, possibly even
>>>>> hacking voting machines is seriously scary business. The evidence
>>>>> is circumstantial but it is enough to warrant an investigation. I
>>>>> read up on the statistical analysis the security experts did and it
>>>>> looks right to me.
>>>>> I mean it's not bologna
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/19/2016 01:33 PM, Carl Jarvis via acb-l wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, of course we might refer to Herr Trump as, Führer, but his
>>>>> Russian title would be, vozhd.
>>>>>
>>>>> Carl Jarvis
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/18/16, Karen Rose <rosekm@earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I only hope to live long enough to see this! And that our New
>>>>> fewer elected by the Russians does not destroy our world before
>>>>> this can happen.
>>>>> Karen
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 18, 2016, at 1:33 PM, Carl Jarvis via acb-l
>>>>> <acb-l@acblists.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Right on, Carla!
>>>>> Not only do I see the day when all transportation vehicles are
>>>>> driverless, but they will be "on demand" to citizens, foregoing
>>>>> the need to make expensive purchases. A touch of a button and a
>>>>> car awaits you at the curb. Furthermore, I predict that these
>>>>> cars will use no oil products to run them. They will float on a
>>>>> cushion of air and be driven by the Earth's magnetic energy.
>>>>> Solar energy will run our homes and even water craft will float
>>>>> above the water. It will be a very quiet world. Homes will be
>>>>> built in the hills and mountains, leaving flat, fertile bottom
>>>>> land for crops.
>>>>> Of course, if we don't get with it soon, there will be no one
>>>>> left to enjoy it all.
>>>>>
>>>>> Carl Jarvis
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/18/16, Carla Ruschival via acb-l <acb-l@acblists.org> wrote:
>>>>> For the last week, there has been at least one story every day,
>>>>> sometimes more, about people being killed in automobile
>>>>> accidents around town and nearby. I daresay that is true of most
>>>>> metropolitan areas.
>>>>>
>>>>> So, if we don't want to see anyone get hurt, we should outlaw
>>>>> all cars until the killing of thousands on our highways, and the
>>>>> maiming of tens of thousands, including children, can be put to
>>>>> a stop.
>>>>>
>>>>> Since this suggestion is obviously ridiculous, why are we so
>>>>> worried about the development of the driverless car? In m1llions
>>>>> of miles of testing, it has certainly proven to be far safer
>>>>> than the vehicles we use every day.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bring it on.
>>>>>
>>>>> Carla
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Dec 15, 2016, at 12:09 PM, Rich Vonderhaar via leadership
>>>>> <leadership@acblists.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Here's a link to an article that came out this morning about the
>>>>> driverless car thing. While I think it is a great idea, I would
>>>>> hate
>>>>> to
>>>>> see any one get hurt.
>>>>> https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/dec/14/uber-self-driving-cars-run-red-lights-san-francisco
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Rich V
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> leadership mailing list
>>>>> leadership@acblists.org
>>>>> http://www.acblists.org/mailman/listinfo/leadership
>>>>>
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